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Transfer Talk Topic

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life   
1 hour ago, jones said:

Yes, Toulon tournament is not PL. But they are the best performers for England. By some distance too. 

Conte should spend his budget on 3-4 players of absolute quality. Get rid of players he dont need or that does not have the right mentality. And supplement with young, hungry players eager to impress.

Sorry, when I meant competition, I actually meant their level of talent and maturity compared to their team mates and opponents, not the actual intensity of the competition. But I agree with you whole heartedly, atm the look to be above the rest.

I agree with your conte comment too.

Seeing loftus and traore show more desire and fight than the likes of oscar and matic made me sick.

 

 

10 minutes ago, James Prescott said:

Who is to say if people like Baker, Abraham and RLC were given proper runs, they couldn't do a Rashford? Honestly? And in pre-season I am sure some of them will get chances. 

Reports in Italy saying we're well advanced in getting Rudiger, for about 30 million Euros. I'd be good with that. 

Well said... and I'm not even a Rashford admirer. We have better on our hands, and we don't seem to be able to purchase the likes of pogba easily... . So why not blood the ones who have the potential to be as big as them?

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jones   
9 hours ago, Droy was my hero said:

The whole game is up on football origin, but after 20 mins I got bored.  It really is not a high level, and it is really mistakes being made that result in entertainment.  Both sides seem to have players who look awkward to be up against players as good as themselves for once.  

The idea that players doing well here are playing themselves into a senior role at Chelsea is just ludicrous.  To a marginal role at place 21-28 in the pecking order, perhaps.  to be given a chance in training to rival themselves against one or two of the senior 20 pros perhaps.

Who said that?

My point was that our three CMs are probably the three best CMs under 21 in the country. Which means they have quality. They win stuff too, tournaments, golden boots, top performers. Which means they have winning mentality. All of them have enough experience to not be shaking like leaves when they are thrown in at PL level. They are 20, not 17. And they are much more ready to play than someone like Rashford was when he was thrown on. 

We know that RLC is already there, but I genuinely believe one of the other two has a chance as well. If Conte wants more players with the necessary quality and the right mentality, Baker and Chalobah are good and cheap options.

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27 minutes ago, jones said:

Who said that?

My point was that our three CMs are probably the three best CMs under 21 in the country. Which means they have quality. They win stuff too, tournaments, golden boots, top performers. Which means they have winning mentality. All of them have enough experience to not be shaking like leaves when they are thrown in at PL level. They are 20, not 17. And they are much more ready to play than someone like Rashford was when he was thrown on. 

We know that RLC is already there, but I genuinely believe one of the other two has a chance as well. If Conte wants more players with the necessary quality and the right mentality, Baker and Chalobah are good and cheap options.

Well you just said that.  You are not alone.

Chelsea have had a hell of a lot of u21 players in the past.  Very few of them went through to be first team regulars.  This has been true ever since football went to U21 football from U23 football.

Josh McEachran had 13 U21 caps.  Chalobah has 30 caps and showing no sign of breaking through in adult football.  Michael Mancienne had 30 U21 caps.

RLC knows this, he has an elder brother with 8 U21 goals.

 

Funny - we have a player in the full England tea that people want shot off, and players in the U21 who people think deserve to start....

Edited by Droy was my hero

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Harvz   

So proud of RLC yesterday. Yes, got given an ear bashing for not chasing back enough, but I doubt that's every going to completely disappear from his game. Baker was outstanding too. 

My favourite player in the world - that we don't already have - is Pogba. The more I see RLC, the less I actually want us to sign him, provided one of our domestic rivals doesn't get him instead.

More generally, I'm not expecting marquee signings this summer from Conte, and the more I think about it, the more disappointed I'd be if after his years at Italy manager, he didn't pluck one or two upcoming Italian stars from relative obscurity and add them to the first team squad. Surely there's a 21/22 year old or two hiding in a Atalanta or a Sassuolo that hasn't yet made the biggest headlines - but that's about to.

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31 minutes ago, jones said:

My point was that our three CMs are probably the three best CMs under 21 in the country

Well I can certainly think of one CM younger than all of them who is better.  And then a couple of others about a year older that also just played for the Full England team. 

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Give a young player a chance ... by making him an automatic starter after 6 (let's face it, fairly nothing) league starts. Same old nonsense. Pathological.

 

 

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cam4blue   
11 hours ago, James Prescott said:

Who is to say if people like Baker, Abraham and RLC were given proper runs, they couldn't do a Rashford? Honestly?

Rashford didn't need a "proper run". He scored twice on his debut in the Europa and then scored twice and got an assist on his Prem debut against Arsenal. Every player who has started a single meaningless game for us has had as much of a chance as he needed to prove he deserved to be in the first team reckoning more often. 

Same with Kane (assist for the winner after coming on in the 83rd minute in his first game under Pochettino), and Alli (looked good in a 10 minute cameo on his debut, scored in a 30 minute cameo in a 1-1 draw against Leicester in his second appearance for the club). 

I think some are forgetting that a young player has to do well to show why they deserve more games; not keep getting games on the off-chance they do well. 

FWIW I think our young players have the same mentality as some posters here (and the scouts who discovered them definitely do). They feel they are entitled to a "run" in the team rather than using every cameo as an opportunity to earn their next appearance. The one exception (for me) would be Tammy Abraham, who wanted it more in his couple of cameos than any "youth player" I can think of here in a decade. 

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13 hours ago, life said:

And in the poor season like this, if the club couldn't trust youth more. When we were out of everything, nothing to play for then I feel there is no point of us having youth... money should be better spent elsewhere. Just stick to buying for big money. Those who got the chance they needed.

This is relevant. 

I see two reasons;

1) Hiddink didn't care about giving youth a chance

2) They are so far off from being first team material the club couldn't be bothered to include them knowing they're off on loan in the summer anyways

Either case, it's grim reading and questions what the h*** we are doing at U-21 level. Why so much money is poured into the U-21's/U-18's when we aren't bothered playing them or can't produce players good enough to be played. 

 

13 hours ago, jones said:

Conte should spend his budget on 3-4 players of absolute quality. Get rid of players he dont need or that does not have the right mentality. And supplement with young, hungry players eager to impress.

Completely agree with this. 

If we end up buying 6 £10m players who are just going to be squad fillers I'll be utterly disappointed. On our way to cement ourselves as a mid-table team if that happens imo.

 

12 hours ago, James Prescott said:

Reports in Italy saying we're well advanced in getting Rudiger, for about 30 million Euros. I'd be good with that. 

Like stated elsewhere, we will be linked to around 50 players this summer (if we haven't already). You will say all of them are exactly what we need, and are good players for the price we pay. 

Have you ever seen Rudiger play? 

3 hours ago, Droy was my hero said:

Well I can certainly think of one CM younger than all of them who is better.  And then a couple of others about a year older that also just played for the Full England team. 

Like who? 

23 minutes ago, cam4blue said:

FWIW I think our young players have the same mentality as some posters here (and the scouts who discovered them definitely do). They feel they are entitled to a "run" in the team rather than using every cameo as an opportunity to earn their next appearance. The one exception (for me) would be Tammy Abraham, who wanted it more in his couple of cameos than any "youth player" I can think of here in a decade. 

I'm not sure I'd say that about the youngsters we have seen progress from U-16's etc but I'd certainly say that has been true regarding some of our 'loan army' signings - you know the layer of players who have played quite a bit at other european leagues. 

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kratos   

The situation is this, we fininished 10th.

Alot of the players can do better than what they have shown but there is that doubt that they can still be susceptible to the problems and mistakes that we witnessed through out last season.

We need first team additions and ones that are ready to step in and perform.

It is going to be a battle for the top 4 next season and if we are not careful we could get bypassed again by the others.

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16 hours ago, jones said:

Conte should spend his budget on 3-4 players of absolute quality. Get rid of players he dont need or that does not have the right mentality. And supplement with young, hungry players eager to impress.

This ...

2 hours ago, Sleeping Dave said:

Completely agree with this. 

If we end up buying 6 £10m players who are just going to be squad fillers I'll be utterly disappointed. On our way to cement ourselves as a mid-table team if that happens imo.

... and this agreement ... Here's what I don't get about it ... These 'young, hungry players' (let's leave to aside for a moment that the characterisation of young players as having greater desire, implicitly greater than more senior players, is one of the more hilarious but still base cliches still somehow doing the rounds in football) who can apparently make up the numbers in place of squad filling signings ... Which of them are better or would command a greater fee than the shop-bought squad fillers?

From where I'm standing, absolutely none of them. Which of our young players would be starting more often than not at the sort of clubs (I'd say anything between maybe 6th and 13th in the PL and for the most part anything below 3rd place in any other European league, higher than even that in most) that you might expect 'squad fillers' to be signed from? Keeping in mind obviously that they were not deemed good enough by two managers, one  in a fit of career-low desperation who chopped and changed rather a lot before the axe fell and another who had almost literally nothing to lose for a good three months of the season, to get much playing time in a side that slumped to 10th?

I have no doubt that there is a culture at the club that inhibits the progression of our youth players. But there is also no reasonable doubt that most of those who have been in our ranks over the last decade and most who are there now are simply not good enough, and not just for Chelsea but for any decent football team.

I cannot see how we will be better off, and especially in absolutely critical season, bunging 'hungry' (give me strength, one of them is apparently on £65k after, and it really needs repeating, 6 league starts) into squad roles rather than filling them with players who have shown they can do a job over a career.

We have a bit of an odd advantage next year in that we'll have far fewer games, and for me that does facilitate a bit more of whatever budget we have being spent on players who are intended to immediately depose one of the 12 or 13 senior players we have. But it will be of little use if those deposed players are moved on and replaced with kids who weren't even close to them in our worst season for a decade.

Maybe we are screwed with six £10m players. Can't see how we're any less screwed without them.

Edit: Just to further underline the point that 'hunger' is a nonsense, it is being reported now that Rashford has signed a £20k a week deal at United. Loftus-Cheek, who has been far less impressive and far greater touted even outside of partisan fans, is allegedly on £65k a week. I expect neither figure is accurate and the clubs are treated very differently when it comes to money and contracts by the press, but even as rough figures it is demonstrative of what appears to me to be a significant problem with younger players at Chelsea, and one that relates to alleged 'hunger'.

Edited by thevelourfog

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