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Michael Tucker

Manchester United 4 Chelsea 0

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2 hours ago, Blue_In_Every_Way said:

Well its easy to dismiss it as one game, isn't it?

But really, that is what we should do.  

Read the reaction from Man Utd fanatics and 'unbiased' ::cough cough:: pundits alike and you'll notice that they are doing the exact same thing but with opposing views in that after one game they have won the league, FA Cup, Champions League, League Cup, World Cup, Ashes, mens 100m at the Olympics, WBC heavyweight title and every other half decent trophy worth mentioning.

It is only one game and as much as some reactions to our loss are so utterly and ridiculously dooms day-esque, the red half of Manchester are doing the same thing up there - overreacting to the first 90 minute session of 38!

There is a long way to go before we should be saying yay, nay or otherwise for this Chelsea side, with this manager, this season.

Edited by KingThistle

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7 hours ago, Mark Kelly said:

Normally , I am the voice of insanity here but even I can see that it's one game , away to a side who have attacking prowess in abundance , have improved their defence to the tune of £120m and won four nil without deserving one of them .

As we go into the season , serving a transfer ban for no apparent reason whilst everyone else who needs to is strengthening their sides ,  I still cannot fathom why our club is the only club who didn't ask for the ban to be deferred .

If the boards innate stupidity leads to Lampard losing his job as he struggles on without a single player of quality other than Kante and Jorginho and possibly Kepa and Mount then this time I want to see action at board level leading to heads rolling .

Lions led by donkeys ( and I love donkeys , but not in this instance ) 

Because we are like a woman (or man) suffering domestic abuse. We are too scared to say anything or do anything that might make things worse. This emboldens the abuser who just keeps up the beatings. I assume we have a legal team at CFC, I'm just not sure exactly what they do (take long lunches most likely).

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7 hours ago, Mark Kelly said:

As we go into the season , serving a transfer ban for no apparent reason whilst everyone else who needs to is strengthening their sides ,  I still cannot fathom why our club is the only club who didn't ask for the ban to be deferred .

 

It is a good question.  The only answer I would rule out is that the board is incompetent - we know how untrue that is.  Arsenal's board is incompetent.  Arguably Man U's board has been incompetent post SAF.   We have had 2 bad seasons this millennium and loads and loads of good ones with trophies.

Potential answers are:

  • fear of an extended ban (I doubt this, but others don't)
  • a short term experiment based on current promising youth (let us just say opinions vary on this)
  • that we did attempt an deferment but for some unknown reason it was not accepted or declined 
  • that the club took the view that prices were high, TV money is falling and that this was bad timing for a big splurge into the market spending 2 years money
  • that the club is up for sale and it is thought easier to sell if the new owner gets to choose the expensive  fixtures and fittings rather than have then thrust upon him. 

Anyone else got other ideas?

For me the last two are favourites, but the club has been unusually quiet on the potential deferment - in fact the nearest it has got to making a statement on the matter were some vague references by SFL a few weeks ago.

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23 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:

Anyone else got other ideas?

I've said elsewhere and someone said a page or so back... Could be we calculated that CAS would take the view we did break the rules but not on purpose or maliciously and might be more inclined to reduce the ban if we were seen to genuinely protesting rather than using bureaucracy to delay the inevitable? 

Edited by thevelourfog

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27 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:

It is a good question.  The only answer I would rule out is that the board is incompetent - we know how untrue that is.  Arsenal's board is incompetent.  Arguably Man U's board has been incompetent post SAF.   We have had 2 bad seasons this millennium and loads and loads of good ones with trophies.

Potential answers are:

  • fear of an extended ban (I doubt this, but others don't)
  • a short term experiment based on current promising youth (let us just say opinions vary on this)
  • that we did attempt an deferment but for some unknown reason it was not accepted or declined 
  • that the club took the view that prices were high, TV money is falling and that this was bad timing for a big splurge into the market spending 2 years money
  • that the club is up for sale and it is thought easier to sell if the new owner gets to choose the expensive  fixtures and fittings rather than have then thrust upon him. 

Anyone else got other ideas?

For me the last two are favourites, but the club has been unusually quiet on the potential deferment - in fact the nearest it has got to making a statement on the matter were some vague references by SFL a few weeks ago.

 

4 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

I've said elsewhere and someone said a page or so back... Could be we calculated that CAS would take the view we did break the rules but not on purpose or maliciously and might be more inclined to reduce the ban if we were seen to genuinely protesting rather than using bureaucracy to delay the inevitable? 

It is certainly a head scratcher ,I'm hoping TVF is right here and the "powers that be" relent and let us off in time for a January splurge , maybe by then CAS will have exonerated us from blame anyway seeing as it's intimated we followed the guidelines of the FA and we'll be out from under ?

There's a few rich'uns left around so maybe we are up for sale but the omens aren't great seeing as the bloke who tried to buy us last time has just bought Nice . 

 

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35 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

I've said elsewhere and someone said a page or so back... Could be we calculated that CAS would take the view we did break the rules but not on purpose or maliciously and might be more inclined to reduce the ban if we were seen to genuinely protesting rather than using bureaucracy to delay the inevitable? 

I question that any form of bureaucracy will or would actually decide something was unfair because Chelsea in this case have been "nice" about accepting the decision against them.

Probably the opposite as it shows "they" were correct in the decisions!

Having said that of course I hope the ban will be eased but in the meantime we..Chelsea that is..have to deal with the situation as it is..not how we want it to pan out.

The game?....have to admit I switched of after about 20 minutes as I couldn't handle what I thought would be the inevitable conclusion..getting too old for the stress of big opponent games. (Handled B'mouth last season but...)… I do not have the analytical strength of TVF for instance..usually spot on..but I do have a strong instinctive feeling about the game and am usually right....looked good and as mentioned by most if Tammy's post strike had gone in..which it deserved... it would have been a different game but that is THE GAME I'm afraid..small margins at critical stages change everything..

SFL should be given this very difficult season to find a way forward without the hyenas gathering at every perceived misstep. Any other year this fixture mid season would have been met with dismay but not seen as anything but another away defeat at a difficult ground regardless of reasons. 37 games to go..keep expectations sensible and hope that the youngsters can get experience with less pressure than a "normal" season would bring...Kante,Rudiger,Willian..and  later and probably lesser extent CHO and RLC to come into contention will hopefully ease the situation.

Watching Norwich I wonder where they will go this year..a suicidal approach akin to the Light Brigade folly..are Chelsea that open to question?

Not a doom and gloom question..BUT..if Chelsea were relegated how many of you here would stop following?

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58 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

I've said elsewhere and someone said a page or so back... Could be we calculated that CAS would take the view we did break the rules but not on purpose or maliciously and might be more inclined to reduce the ban if we were seen to genuinely protesting rather than using bureaucracy to delay the inevitable? 

52 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said:

It is certainly a head scratcher ,I'm hoping TVF is right here and the "powers that be" relent and let us off in time for a January splurge , maybe by then CAS will have exonerated us from blame anyway seeing as it's intimated we followed the guidelines of the FA and we'll be out from under ?

There's a few rich'uns left around so maybe we are up for sale but the omens aren't great seeing as the bloke who tried to buy us last time has just bought Nice . 

Problem with this idea is that there really is so little to be gained by having a January Splurge.  Very few good deals are available in January - and most of those actually are loan backs to Summer.  IMO Summer 19 alone is worse than Winter 19/20 + Summer 20 or at least equal.  At least now we can offer CL games, which I doubt we can say next summer or even by January.

Something is not being said.

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3 hours ago, Conte Kante said:

I think too many on here are taking the criticism personally or they think it is aimed at SFL

I am only referring to posters who are directly saying Lampard needs to adapt, change ,improve, sort things out etc with some  inferring that he's not up to the job ....after one loss to a good team. This is a man fighting with one hand behind his back , and do you know what, I saw something on Sunday. I saw a new team with kids and inexperience, take a match to the United on their turf and give them plenty to think about. As Olly said, United were lucky to go in at half time and not be losing...an honest but true statement. The pen meant we were chasing the game and got punished but 4 nil was absolutely no reflection. Fine margins. Tammys shot goes 6 inches to the right and we might well have won that game. We were not perfect but we were quick to ball, energetic in the press, moved the ball at speed and were generally very positive.  We lack a goalscorer and are making defensive errors but I look forward to some great games and some big scalps this season.

 

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56 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:

Problem with this idea is that there really is so little to be gained by having a January Splurge.  Very few good deals are available in January - and most of those actually are loan backs to Summer.  IMO Summer 19 alone is worse than Winter 19/20 + Summer 20 or at least equal.  At least now we can offer CL games, which I doubt we can say next summer or even by January.

Something is not being said.

True, but my hypothesis is based on the idea that we calculated successfully challenging from the off was never going to succeed and that there just weren't any other genuine options. Usually I'd 100% agree there's little to be gained from January spending but I think this season is different by virtue of there just being so many different positions we're weak in. In that sense, it is much easier to improve than any other January since the winter window came into play. And as you like to say yourself, deals are done months in advance... Could be that a few instantly ready players are waiting. 

Could also be no such thing and that we're f**ked completely though, equally if not more likely true! 

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3 minutes ago, NoblyBobly said:

I am only referring to posters who are directly saying Lampard needs to adapt, change ,improve, sort things out etc with some  inferring that he's not up to the job ....after one loss to a good team. This is a man fighting with one hand behind his back , and do you know what, I saw something on Sunday. I saw a new team with kids and inexperience, take a match to the United on their turf and give them plenty to think about.

Well congratulations.  But I saw a tactically very naive team get taken to the cleaners by a team making not that much effort.  A lesson in top level tactics.
I also saw the team that was 6th last year that was man for man better than us in 9/11 positions (Jorginho and Mount IMO).  I get that we have the weaker team, but we ought to be playing accordingly.

Energetic in the press is fine if it leads to goals, but no goals just means no energy 2nd half.

9 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

Could also be no such thing and that we're f**ked completely though, equally if not more likely true! 

Summer 2020 and we could find Jorghinho, Rudiger, Kante and Kepa as targets for other clubs.

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