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Poor management by SFL. In the 343 formation we looked comfortable at the back and had been defending set pieces well. Admittedly we were not creating much but at that point you take the point, especially as we have a lot of important injuries atm - Rudi, Kante, Mount, CHO etc. That decision was up their with bringing on Gilmour at 2-1 up with our backs against the wall. 

As for Willian tonight proved why he has never been an elite player. Great technical skill and brilliant feet but inefficient in the final third by failing to pick his passes or shoot properly. There is a reason a AM of his ability has goals and assits stats like he does. 

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38 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:

neither willian or Jorginho looked happy with his decision.

Sure. Both experienced penalty takers, seasoned internationals, and this was a substitute stepping up. I would be shocked if they looked pleased. But an argument? Not really.

Besides, Willian and Jorginho are hardly convincing themselves.

This isn't Frank Lampard himself stepping up. It would have still been pretty iffy even if either of those guys stepped up IMO.

Edited by Blue_In_Every_Way

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I know we have to expect results like that while Frank is learning on the job. But I don’t get why a rusty Pedro comes on for Mount instead of Pulisic. Pedro was bloody dreadful and seeing him play upfront with an erratic Willian was all the motivation Valencia needed. 

When we were struggling second half, Lampard then takes off Zouma for Giroud, which gave Valencia even more encouragement to go for it. They scored soon after. 

And what is it with our set piece defending? We looked like a bunch of poorly coached schoolkids playing on a Sunday in the park.

Then the penalty farce ensued which topped off a shambolic night. 

I really hope we don’t end up in the bloody Europa league again come February. But it might save us from more embarrassment like tonight.

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paulw66   
40 minutes ago, chelboy said:

So Lamps just confirmed Ross is 1st pen taker. That was silly  from Jorginho and Willian then. If the manager has an order you follow it. They should not try and take it off him. Very silly. Whether he misses or scores Lamps should have a word with Jorg and Willian. 

Nope.

37 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:

Precisely what I would say if I were Lamps.
But let him not try that one again - if he gets another chance in a Chelsea shirt.

Come back Kante quick.

Yup

34 minutes ago, OfWolfAndBiggs said:

So Barkley (not taken a penalty in 3.5 years) is now ahead of Jorginho (already scored a pen this season)? 

Like Solksjaer I’m not sure Franks being completely honest. 

Agreed

26 minutes ago, chelboy said:

He was taking them in pre season while Jorginho was on the pitch. It seems odd but I don’t think we are clear in that department. I don’t think Frank is lying. 

He is clearly lying as doesn't want to throw that useless Scouse moron under the bus.

22 minutes ago, Arkie said:

Almost certainly Frank is lying.

Why would Barkley be number 1 penalty take when he doesn’t play more than 10 minutes a game?

 

Yup

For anyone in doubt or who actually still believes Barkley was the designated taker, ask yourself why he ran to get the ball and put it on the spot before anyone else had worked out what was happening and were still milling about on the halfway line? If he knew he was the taker, he wouldn't have needed to do that. Just casually take the ball and put it down.

Was like watching a kid in a playground kickabout hoping not to get overruled by the bigger boys. 

It is to our bigger boys discredit that they did nothing.

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16 minutes ago, King Kante said:

Poor management by SFL.

One of those games where IMO Frank and the team didn't do too badly.  But where we just don't have the control over games to stop them becoming just random.
Still I daresay Frank will come in for a bit of stick this time.

4 minutes ago, King Kante said:

That decision was up their with bringing on Gilmour at 2-1 up with our backs against the wall. 

We know why Gilmour came on, Kovacic was injured and not able to continue.  We just don't have many midfielders, let alone fit ones.  If anything Kovacic should have been allowed to come off earlier.

 

11 minutes ago, Blue_In_Every_Way said:

Sure. Both experienced penalty takers, seasoned internationals, and this was a substitute stepping up. I would be shocked if they looked pleased. But an argument? Not really.

Besides, Willian and Jorginho are hardly convincing themselves.

If the decision is clear, you don't dispute who is taking it at all.  They clearly thought he shouldn't be taking it.  And Jorginho  clearly felt he needed to go back and wish Barkley luck, so he must have said something less than friendly first time around.
For me that is a big row.

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paulw66   
17 minutes ago, Blue_In_Every_Way said:

Sure. Both experienced penalty takers, seasoned internationals, and this was a substitute stepping up. I would be shocked if they looked pleased. But an argument? Not really.

Besides, Willian and Jorginho are hardly convincing themselves.

This isn't Frank Lampard himself stepping up. It would have still been pretty iffy even if either of those guys stepped up IMO.

You mean the same Jorginho who takes Italy's penalties? Ok.

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12 minutes ago, paulw66 said:

Was like watching a kid in a playground kickabout hoping not to get overruled by the bigger boys. 

It is to our bigger boys discredit that they did nothing.

...Azpi.   
Whatever one thinks about Luiz he'd have been in there sorting it out (and possibly taking it himself:happy:  ).

11 minutes ago, paulw66 said:

You mean the same Jorginho who takes Italy's penalties? Ok.

Can't score in open play, but is a brilliant penalty taker.

Edit:  what really gets me here is the lack of respect for Willian and Jorginho.  These guys are serious players with real track records.  Barkley was our 5th choice CM last season, 6th now after Mount.  His track record is in the physio room.
A little bolshiness is very attractive in a 20 year old trying to create an impression at Everton.  Barkley is 25 and the impression is no longer as promising.

Edited by Droy was my hero
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Is it just me who thinks Kepa should've done better with their goal? It wasn't exactly the best effort and he seemed to find a way to go under it.

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For the first time this season I sat through most of the game really really  missing the sight of Hazard. I was waiting for an average Chelsea performance to be turned around by an incredible bit of skill by the little man, and then see him knee slide towards the corner flag with the crowd going crazy. I was also imagining him placing the ball on the penalty spot and a few seconds later watch the net bulge.  

Ah memories. But as an old country song once said "there aint no future in the past". We can't replace him and it hurts, but I still see a bright, promising and exciting future. It will include frustrating nights like tonight. A draw would have been fair and a victory not an outrage, but 7 or 8 games in and our injury list (and to the players that matter) is as long as it was at the start of the season.  Frank has not had a lot of luck in that department and now we must add Mount to that list. Last season with only 'nothing' group games in the Europa League Sarri could put out his B squad out without concerns of risking high value players. No such luxury with CL opposition. 

On the positive, Tomorri looks fantastic. No question he is good enough for us. In fact, it is the old experienced hands that are letting us down , not the bright young academy things. Willian looked up for it but we got the same old rubbish end product. Jorginho is just...well Jorginho, Pedro is on the decline, Aspi is on the decline (although much better in that position I thought) , Kova blows hot and cold, Barclay seems to be an England fixture but deserves no more than warming our bench and the worlds most expensive keeper still looks bang average. And can someone please please keep Christenson in after training a few times for offensive heading practice. Apart from that he is looking much more the part. 

Lastly wishing Mark K well. I was thinking of you when eventually a var went our way, then also when we sadly blew the opportunity (typical).

And no Mark , your right, we would never have been given that decision in the Premier league!! 

Roll on the dippers. They were shite tonight too. 

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Blue Rod   

I know dodgy half hearted play when I see one, and there was an awful lot of it out there from our senior players. Lampard has his work cut out. Now he has to go all the way and build his own squad. That may mean writing off this season. What I saw tonight from the likes of Alonso, Willian, Pedro,  Azpilicueta and Kepa gives me cause for concern. I dont think we have had a goalkeeper perform this poorly match after match for a long while. 

Edited by Blue Rod

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