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JaneB   
1 hour ago, Droy was my hero said:

 

I do get that others see this differently.  I spent most of my adult life in another country,  a third of that time talking in a language I was only 90% fluent in, and much of the rest talking in English mostly to people who weren't really fluent either.  I'm both more sympathetic to Sarri, and more practiced in deciphering his language.  I know how powerful it was to insist that the people who worked for me spoke in English, and that I could look a complete idiot trying to tell them what to do in their language.  Frank on the other hand has spent all his career in England (or US), and has media stars as uncle, cousin, wife and even his agent's ex-wife.

Not sure what that has got to do with the price of fish, except to give me the chance to say that Kay Burley is an acquired taste which I can do without, even if she did stick up for Frank once.  I suppose Harry and Jamie could be described as media stars, in a comic way.  The real star is the wonderful Christine, Frank's greatest asset. 

But actually it seemed to me that Sarri revealed much more than Frank does.  (And strangely he inherited a whole lot of players and a few coaches who already spoke Italian).

No, still don't see that.

Cliches - trouble is that some managers go to English lessons and learn English cliches and use them in interviews.  Pity.  JM was far better - too fluent already to need a language lesson, he simply translated existing phrases from Portugese and Spanish into English and gave us some wonderful expressions.  "They killed us", "not out of the bottle" were wonderful if you are interested in how phrases translate across languages.

It does have to be said that many British managers/players speak in clichés too, I.e. "It doesn't matter that I scored the goal(s), it's just important that we got the three points"  Yeah right.  "We're not looking any further than the next match".  "Well I couldn't see the incident from where I was sitting...…."  "There was no intent there, he's not that sort of lad".

Sorry -  It really is 'resist' applied to football. 
Clearer?

Nope.  Is it a game?

 

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kev61   
5 hours ago, NoblyBobly said:

Well that's just not true because if Frank had a magic wand he would have waved over Jorge during the close season and out would have popped a great player. As far as I'm concerned the improvement started relatively recently and I was quite critical or Jorge in early games this season ( United and Norwich spring to mind  ) , in fact I remember saying to someone around that time( it may have been you) that I would like nothing better than to claim that FL had achieved what Sarri couldn't, but I honestly couldn't see any difference from some of last season's displays. 

The fact is during recent games , in my eyes at least, he seems ever more composed, more aware and defensively much more on it. If he can keep it up and add assists and the odd goal then fabulous. Maybe it's too easy to say it's all down to Lampard, maybe it's  down to Jorghinho himself , maybe it's a bit of both. He certainly seemed very keen to play for Lampard and never expressed a desire to join Sarri in Italy. I've nothing against him whatsoever. He seems a nice lad with his head screwed on and no airs and graces....And more importantly wants to play for Chelsea. We can differ until the cows come home on what he was like last season but it's not going to change my opinion on that because I can rewatch all the games and I will still come to the same conclusion. I saw him then and I see him now. 

Common sense as usual Nobly said with the usual grace.I am exasperated with some people's opinion but it is their right to express it.Sarri was turning into a fool that Mourhino had become without even knowing it.

As for statistics,there are people that thinks if a white horse wins the grand national three times in a row you should put  your house on a white horse to win it the fourth time - as we know it is pure coincidence without any 'true, statistics.Sarri got lucky with the 'success' he had with us,he is clueless and certainly more clueless that Conte.Even with the transfer ban Sarri would never have played the kids.Do folk remember him calling Kante out in public! and Hazard! both of them saved his ass!.I wish him well but we are well rid.

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2 hours ago, JaneB said:

Sorry -  It really is 'resist' applied to football. 
Clearer?

Nope.  Is it a game?

It's the boneheaded determination to take what might well be a culturally reasonable prejudice against someone (in US that would be Trump) into a totally illogical set of allegations (that the guy who didn't start taking campaign contributions till long after he was a billionaire and was then investigated by the Mueller commission chock-a-block full of Democrat contributors might be the crook).  It is so easy to spot when people do it.
By all means love Frank and hate Sarri (or Fatty not so long ago in my case).  Just don't make up stuff to justify it.  

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20 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:


By all means love Frank and hate Sarri (or Fatty not so long ago in my case).  Just don't make up stuff to justify it.  

OK, I'll bite: who is making up 'stuff', and what 'stuff' are you referring to?

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kev61   
1 hour ago, Droy was my hero said:

It's the boneheaded determination to take what might well be a culturally reasonable prejudice against someone (in US that would be Trump) into a totally illogical set of allegations (that the guy who didn't start taking campaign contributions till long after he was a billionaire and was then investigated by the Mueller commission chock-a-block full of Democrat contributors might be the crook).  It is so easy to spot when people do it.
By all means love Frank and hate Sarri (or Fatty not so long ago in my case).  Just don't make up stuff to justify it.  

Trump is not even a good businessman - he inherited  the billionaire status from his crook father - if he had put the billions he inherited  in the bank he would be breaking even - statistics?

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paulw66   
8 hours ago, kev61 said:

Common sense as usual Nobly said with the usual grace.I am exasperated with some people's opinion but it is their right to express it.Sarri was turning into a fool that Mourhino had become without even knowing it.

As for statistics,there are people that thinks if a white horse wins the grand national three times in a row you should put  your house on a white horse to win it the fourth time - as we know it is pure coincidence without any 'true, statistics.Sarri got lucky with the 'success' he had with us,he is clueless and certainly more clueless that Conte.Even with the transfer ban Sarri would never have played the kids.Do folk remember him calling Kante out in public! and Hazard! both of them saved his ass!.I wish him well but we are well rid.

Has Jorginho been benched yet, Kev?

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Without wishing to start any debate again. One of my main discussion points yesterday was about Kovacic playing without the Sarri shackles, it developed from that point really.

I am posting the link as I didn't know Kovacic had commented on this, until it came up in Lampards press conference yesterday. So basically, the man himself has confirmed he has more freedom playing under Lampard.

The usual suspects will discredit the quote as always, I am not starting the debate again and wont be responding ref this. Yes, it is a Croatian quote, but it also appears in numerous other UK outlets.

https://transferlive.hr/mateo-kovacic-now-I-have-more-confidence-and-freedom/

 

 

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37 minutes ago, LeBoeufsGolfBall said:

Without wishing to start any debate again. One of my main discussion points yesterday was about Kovacic playing without the Sarri shackles, it developed from that point really.

I am posting the link as I didn't know Kovacic had commented on this, until it came up in Lampards press conference yesterday. So basically, the man himself has confirmed he has more freedom playing under Lampard.

The usual suspects will discredit the quote as always, I am not starting the debate again and wont be responding ref this. Yes, it is a Croatian quote, but it also appears in numerous other UK outlets.

https://transferlive.hr/mateo-kovacic-now-I-have-more-confidence-and-freedom/

 

 

Sorry this is bizarre.  Other than a few lesser game where Jorginho was given a rest, Kovacic played in the same role doing the same things as Barkley and RLC who certainly weren't "restricted".
All it proves is that players just not there head when given leading questions by hacks, and say "yes, yes, it is all going great".

9 hours ago, Michael Tucker said:

OK, I'll bite: who is making up 'stuff', and what 'stuff' are you referring to?

Jorginho being better than last year, players playing with more joy, just look at the post I reply to and challenge.

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My own two-bob's worth on the Jorginho & Kovacic debate is that both look better players this year that last - And before people think/say it's Sarri that restricted their freedom and/or Lampard gives them their head or words to that/those effects.

Jorginho looked like he does know for the first dozen or so game last season, then other teams worked out that you had to press onto him as early as possible and it nullified our passing movements up the pitch and we turned the ball over more easily. This season with Kovacic playing close to him and not out in wider area, we have two options for transitioning the ball through central areas, including one who can travel with the ball at a pace that beats or is matching those attempting to press. Kovacic is also very skilful, with great 3 yard movement and intelligent enough to make himself an extra yard a great deal of the time.

Opposition teams now have to concern themselves with nullifying both and not just Jorginho. Both are creating space for the other one. Liverpool thus far, are the one team that have been mobile and quick enough throughout their midfield to have prevented the pairing/Lampard's two in central midfield system (in that game it was Jorginho & Kante?) from operating well.

Barkley will never be smart enough to play in that role and I believe his time with us will end at the end of the season. If RLC comes back and hits decent form then we may even see Pedro leaving in the January window, especially so if we do get a ruling that means we can buy in January.

In summary Lampard hasn't so much set them free as devised a pairing and system that means you may get to one but it's really difficult to take both out. Also both have had a season to adjust and a full pre-season to work with the manager.

 

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paulw66   
1 hour ago, LeBoeufsGolfBall said:

Without wishing to start any debate again. One of my main discussion points yesterday was about Kovacic playing without the Sarri shackles, it developed from that point really.

I am posting the link as I didn't know Kovacic had commented on this, until it came up in Lampards press conference yesterday. So basically, the man himself has confirmed he has more freedom playing under Lampard.

The usual suspects will discredit the quote as always, I am not starting the debate again and wont be responding ref this. Yes, it is a Croatian quote, but it also appears in numerous other UK outlets.

https://transferlive.hr/mateo-kovacic-now-I-have-more-confidence-and-freedom/

 

 

The system this year suits Kovacic much better. Playing deep in the double pivot is his best role; it is not his forte being the 3rd midfielder from whom goals are expected. 

The midfield 3 of Jorginho, Kante, Kovacic just doesn't offer enough goals. Fine for City away, not so fine for most of our games. 

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