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JaneB

Southampton 1 Chelsea 1

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Ham   
28 minutes ago, JaneB said:

Pity he's an idiot the rest of the time.

I heard him being interviewed recently for the first time and it quickly became clear why he doesn't get interviewed much.

Put it this way.  He's not a bit too clever. 

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Jasonb   
1 minute ago, Droy was my hero said:

I think Wenger's description is accurate about where we are now.
But to say Abraham, Pulisic, Werner, Mount, Havertz, CHO, Ziyech, Giroud are not gamechangers is wrong.  We have terrific front line options.  And most have done it very impressively at previous clubs.  

The issue is to get the team working together while maintaining balance.  That might take half a season.

The part in bold I agree about and Tuchel got it wrong yesterday if he was looking to get three points.

For me Ziyech has showed very little to date, Giroud's form has been off recently and Abraham and Werner are not clinical.

 

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Blue Rod   

This debate raging on about Jorginho and Kovacic is a bit of a distraction. Under TT we've played some very average teams so far. And I can't remember a single match where either midfielder massively excelled. Decent performances; yes, but no more. Our midfield hasn't had much defending to do, and yet we've managed to create nothing, thanks in part to our forwards running like they've never met each other. 

TT must get the best out of both CMs. Because they plus Kante are all we've got in that position at the moment.  But even when he has achieved that, we would still come short of the top teams in Europe. I hope that I am wrong.  But my judgement is based on the observation that I have never seen either player dominate a match for Chelsea like top CMs often do, even when we are playing relegation strugglers. Can anybody tell me that match where either or both players played their opponents out of the park?

My fear is that we are never more than one game away from the myth of Jorginho and Kovacic going up in smoke. They're going to need each other badly on Tuesday, with Kante on standby. Because defensively, they might struggle badly, and offensively, they've created pretty much zilch in 6 matches. And Tuesday is one of those matches which can advance this Kova/Jorgi debate. Because so far, I have not seen any performance under TT that has elevated either of them above the decent midfielders that they both are. 

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Its fairly obvious that Tuchel came in, wanted to keep things simple and be solid defensively  which in the most part we have been. Problem is we have created very little in all the combined games.

I very much doubt he isn't aware of it. He is know for being very shrewd tactically and more than happy to adapt and change things up.

Personally I think he went with 3 at the back initially to make us more solid and get as much experience in the side as possible in the first half dozen games, knowing full well we have a horrendous run of fixtures coming up. The benefit of playing 3 at the back has been negated by the complete lack of creativity going forward, against pretty average opposition too. 

I do not think it will be too long until we see a switch to 4231.

James Silva Rudiger Chilwell

Kante Mount

CHO Havertz Pulisic

Werner

I'm absolutely convinced this is the team he would want to be playing but with so many of them out of form or injured when he arrived it was impossible so he has made do for the time being. I can see a Conte moment coming up, half time against Arsenal, when he had seen enough, ripped up everything he had been doing and did it his way. 

 

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29 minutes ago, Jasonb said:

I agree on Mount, Pulisic has not been playing much and Wenger would not have seen him yesterday which also applies to Havertz.

CHO is mercurial at best and not dependable though he may develop more under Tuchel.

Two players that might have been game changers are Barkley and RLC yet both have injuries limiting their ability to sprint too much which is why we were happy to loan them.

I think Lampard/TT were very lucky to be allowed to move them on last summer.  Incredibly lucky to be given Ziyech and Havertz instead.

Seems to me that they have proved to be useful occasional players for Villa and Fulham, but no more.  I doubt we will ever see them registered for a Chelsea season again. They are 27 and 25.  If they ever had pace and fitness, it is not coming back now.

4 minutes ago, Martin1905 said:

...

I'm absolutely convinced this is the team he would want to be playing but with so many of them out of form or injured when he arrived it was impossible so he has made do for the time being. I can see a Conte moment coming up, half time against Arsenal, when he had seen enough, ripped up everything he had been doing and did it his way. 

Yes we have only seen stage one of the plan so far.  Yes stage two might see a new system.
it is almost as though he saw FBs being such a key part of the old plan that he wanted a system where the FBs could still play advanced without us being caught at the back so much.
But the WB game relies entirely on us dominating the middle and having spare men out wide.  If we are not a threat through the middle, then our WBs will get marked and become irrelevant.

I saw the Conte moment quite differently.  We were a team that was defending with 8 at the back - 8 in the box - and not picking up opponents on the edge of our area.  Perhaps we were still a little shell-shocked after 15/16, but we certainly already carried cutting edge in attack. 
3atb allowed Conte to tell everyone it meant 3 in our own box max, and everyone else had to be marking opponents.  It was an attitude change that made the difference.  In particular having Kante chase down opponents in front of our box instead of hiding between the legs of our CBs and Matic.
After that it was about reminding Hazard/Costa/Willian that they had won a title just 12 months earlier.  The new tactics helped (there is a Steve Holland talk that explains) but the crucial thing for me was the psychology of defending the pitch, not the box.

For me it was a communication issue.  
TT seems to have got the same twin idea across well:  The priority of a firm defence AND the need for that defending to happen all the way out to their half or further.   But he hasn't found a plan B for when we need to up the momentum and take the odd risk.  And while he has a talented set of attackers for sure, he can't just say do what you did last time you won the prem.

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2 hours ago, Ham said:

I heard him being interviewed recently for the first time and it quickly became clear why he doesn't get interviewed much.

Put it this way.  He's not a bit too clever. 

A lot like Gazza, not very clever

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/1400644/Chelsea-transfer-news-Thomas-Tuchel-Callum-Hudson-Odoi-Southampton

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11 minutes ago, Worsebytheday said:

Simple words cannot convey fully what an absolute crock of **** this article is .

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chara   
32 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said:

Simple words cannot convey fully what an absolute crock of **** this article is .

On a roll Mark...muct be reading my mind...you keep beating me to  points..... and expressing them better!!!

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Bison   
3 hours ago, Jasonb said:

He is right currently we have very few game changers.

How much more do we need to spend before we have some? Another £200m?

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11 hours ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

Classic PL, I miss that era of football, seemed a much simpler time. Maybe it was my age, but it all seemed a lot more fun and less serious back then.

Absolutely 

“he was mowing the grass” - god bless the late GH

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