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paulw66   
1 hour ago, The_Ghost said:

I'm not feeling for Solanke. A case of a youngster beeing convinced by his agent that he needs to ask for a lot more money than he was worth. I'm glad Chelsea didn't agree to be held ransom like that and now they have a great case to show similar youngsters next time it happens. 

Solanke will never amount to anything more than a Championship player. Too bad for him, no great loss for us. 

My point about Solanke was that he and Abraham were peers/equals in the youth team, scoring at similar rates. He must feel as though he made the wrong choices. 

 

37 minutes ago, Bridge Soldier said:

On the other hand, Lamptey certainly looks to have made the right choice. Fair play to him. He's been wonderful to watch at Brighton.

Was never going to leapfrog Reece James.

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1 hour ago, paulw66 said:

My point about Solanke was that he and Abraham were peers/equals in the youth team, scoring at similar rates. He must feel as though he made the wrong choices. 

If I recall they weren't really peers for more than one season even though they were born 3 weeks apart and scored mega goals each that one season.  
Solanke was the star till then, and Abraham well behind him.  There was talk that Abraham had gone from well behind to having over taken him.  But then there was a lot of talk then, either trying to claim Liverpool had bought a young superstar, or trying to justify Chelsea letting the weaker one go.

Certainly Abraham is well ahead now.
If anything I suspect Solanke regrets firstly an early loan to Vitesse where he achieved moderate results.  And secondly not playing for any first team in 16/17 (presumably because he hadn't signed a contract extension).  He played a lot for England U20s around then, but Tammy scored 23 at Bristol City that year and clearly broke through.
Then to make things worse he collected the money from Liverpool and sat on their bench for a season and a half.  
Over 3 and a half seasons from 18 to 21 he barely played (with no injury I think).

Tammy instead got a second bucket of goals for Chelsea young teams the next year, then 3 big learning experiences at Bristol C, Swansea and Villa.

 

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2 hours ago, Bridge Soldier said:

On the other hand, Lamptey certainly looks to have made the right choice. Fair play to him. He's been wonderful to watch at Brighton.

That’s his level. 

Like van arnault, Bernard, ake. 

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2 hours ago, paulw66 said:

My point about Solanke was that he and Abraham were peers/equals in the youth team, scoring at similar rates. He must feel as though he made the wrong choices. 

 

Was never going to leapfrog Reece James.

Perhaps, but as Droy points out it's a ittle bit more comlicated. Solanke never looked at place when he was given the odd rare chance in the first team and after the contract issue his career stopped alltogether.

But no doubt Abraham made the right decisions and Solanke the wrong ones. But I still think that Abraham would have come out on top. 

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42 minutes ago, The_Ghost said:

But no doubt Abraham made the right decisions and Solanke the wrong ones. But I still think that Abraham would have come out on top. 

Yes - or can we say Chelsea made the right decisions and Liverpool the wrong ones.
This season, where Solanke is starting pretty much every game in the Championship for Bournemouth, should be very good for him.

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chara   
2 hours ago, Droy was my hero said:

If I recall they weren't really peers for more than one season even though they were born 3 weeks apart and scored mega goals each that one season.  
Solanke was the star till then, and Abraham well behind him.  There was talk that Abraham had gone from well behind to having over taken him.  But then there was a lot of talk then, either trying to claim Liverpool had bought a young superstar, or trying to justify Chelsea letting the weaker one go.

Certainly Abraham is well ahead now.
If anything I suspect Solanke regrets firstly an early loan to Vitesse where he achieved moderate results.  And secondly not playing for any first team in 16/17 (presumably because he hadn't signed a contract extension).  He played a lot for England U20s around then, but Tammy scored 23 at Bristol City that year and clearly broke through.
Then to make things worse he collected the money from Liverpool and sat on their bench for a season and a half.  
Over 3 and a half seasons from 18 to 21 he barely played (with no injury I think).

Tammy instead got a second bucket of goals for Chelsea young teams the next year, then 3 big learning experiences at Bristol C, Swansea and Villa.

 

Now...that is Droy at the peak of his game....thank you.

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49 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:

Yes - or can we say Chelsea made the right decisions and Liverpool the wrong ones.
This season, where Solanke is starting pretty much every game in the Championship for Bournemouth, should be very good for him.

Sadly, Liverpool did fantastic business with Solanke (buy off us for a couple of million, realise he wasn't up to it, sell him for £20m). They've repeated the trick with Rhian Brewster.

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15 minutes ago, Backbiter said:

Sadly, Liverpool did fantastic business with Solanke (buy off us for a couple of million, realise he wasn't up to it, sell him for £20m). They've repeated the trick with Rhian Brewster.

True.  But we kept Tammy. 
I think we have to remember that when Arnesen was here he got one thing right  (one more than I ever gave him credit for).
He introduced low age Academy groups from the age of 8.  We now know that that worked well and 10 years later that age group was the first to consistently deliver results for us (and West Ham and others).
We seemed to have cornered the market in young English residents born 1997-2001.  Other clubs followed our approach a few years later.
(I am still curious to discover whether the younger training leads to better players or whether we just grabbed the most ambitious talents and their parents first.  Time will tell.)

So whereas prior to 2014 much of our best intake actually came from other clubs aged 14-16 (Bertrand, Ake, Christensen), we then found other clubs poaching players from us.  Plus we had so many talents that we were letting the likes of Rice go  - mistakes are unavoidable.

Edited by Droy was my hero

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chara   
20 minutes ago, Droy was my hero said:

True.  But we kept Tammy. 
I think we have to remember that when Arnesen was here he got one thing right  (one more than I ever gave him credit for).
He introduced low age Academy groups from the age of 8.  We now know that that worked well and 10 years later that age group was the first to consistently deliver results for us (and West Ham and others).
We seemed to have cornered the market in young English residents born 1997-2001.  Other clubs followed our approach a few years later.
(I am still curious to discover whether the younger training leads to better players or whether we just grabbed the most ambitious talents and their parents first.  Time will tell.)

So whereas prior to 2014 much of our best intake actually came from other clubs aged 14-16 (Bertrand, Ake, Christensen), we then found other clubs poaching players from us.  Plus we had so many talents that we were letting the likes of Rice go  - mistakes are unavoidable.

 

Great breakdown....it's the mental strength I believe that makes a difference and spotting the raw young talent at 8/9...a difficult skill. 

The "mistakes" question.....I think it is less a case of mistakes than judgement calls.......the coaching staff have a far deeper understanding of individuals than we do from the sidelines......although not youngsters an oversimplified example of players not fitting at one club but shining at another is the Kepa/Mendy situation as it stands...one slipping and the other blossoming......the staff surely understand this aspect with the youngsters...hard to come up with a true star talent who was let go in error...a lot of good players spread around the game but a JT or  James lost ?

Bamford was a coming man at one time but although not wanting to jinx the game he was successful in a lower league and doing well now but how old is he?...hardly a lost youngster blossoming soon after leaving Chelsea.

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paulw66   
36 minutes ago, chara said:

 

Great breakdown....it's the mental strength I believe that makes a difference and spotting the raw young talent at 8/9...a difficult skill. 

The "mistakes" question.....I think it is less a case of mistakes than judgement calls.......the coaching staff have a far deeper understanding of individuals than we do from the sidelines......although not youngsters an oversimplified example of players not fitting at one club but shining at another is the Kepa/Mendy situation as it stands...one slipping and the other blossoming......the staff surely understand this aspect with the youngsters...hard to come up with a true star talent who was let go in error...a lot of good players spread around the game but a JT or  James lost ?

Bamford was a coming man at one time but although not wanting to jinx the game he was successful in a lower league and doing well now but how old is he?...hardly a lost youngster blossoming soon after leaving Chelsea.

27

 

we couldn't have waited that long 

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