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Jose Mourinho Sacked For The Second Time by Chelsea. Joins Manchester United. And now sacked by them too!

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IMO the reality of the situation is

4) not finished.

The aim this year was to get our first 11 up to the level where it could challenge for trophies; specifically, one that can (should?) win the league. Weaknesses were identified, and remedies were sought. IMO we have that team and come May I think we will be champions (although it won't be easy, and it was never going to be).

The aim long term will be to build a squad that can challenge on every front, and be among the very best in the world. That can't be done overnight given the current reality of football, with squad limits and FFP.

I don't know what the precise schedule is (although I do know that this year the aim is the league title; Jose told us that often enough last season), but IMO we are on track. There was never going to be a grand overhaul, just piecemeal improvements, and (while recognising that perfection is some way off) I (personally) am happy with the progress we have made. Next year, expectations will be higher again (possibly more in line with the expectations of some here, although the reality is that we may not truly see that come fruition for another 2 or 3 seasons), and hopefully we can meet them; chip away more dead wood and add more quality to the squad (something that looks to be under way).

Not finished, of course. That's impossible to disagree with. We are not a finished product yet by a long shot - that much is crystal clear.

I'm not sure many would have expected us to be however and although I've seen massive improvements this season compared to last I'm not sure rotation and the small squad issue will ever be addressed by Mourinho. His ability to build a starting XI was never in any doubt. We may increase the quality of the squad players but I think we will always have a small squad compared to other teams.

Whether that will be a problem for us in the future I don't know. Perhaps the extra quality of the squad players will be enough but at some stage Jose will have to start using his squad more. 2005/06 was the same, he used a set of players (his untouchables) and although we had an amazing team and high quality squad players many didn't get enough playing time. Incidentally we 'only' won the league with possibly the best squad this club has ever seen.

My criticism is directed to this season in isolation although I see some worrying patterns. My hope is of course that we win the league this year, improve over the summer and come out fighting with a stronger squad in 2015/16. The second hope I have is that the HG issue will be solved by giving some of our academy players a fighting chance although that is a longer term project.

My conclusion right now is that the jury is still very much out regarding his ability to use his squad better and to get academy players through. Nothing I've seen this season has made me think he's any closer to achieving that. I hope it will change.

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fatbloke   

If we agree with this, I guess it's fair to say that next time Mourinho criticises the lack of atmosphere at Stamford Bridge people should just hold their hands up and say he's right. No blaming ticket prices , team performances or no standing. We've known for years that the atmosphere can stink (see club shed) the answer is for us to ....... Make more noise.

He is right but that doesn't mean he should say it publicly, it just gives the away fans another stick with which to beat us. If the team performs, or even puts in 100% effort, the support is there. It's very hard to get excited over corned beef when you've been served fillet steak on a regular basis.

Saturday was the perfect example of that.

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fatbloke   

Do you disagree the club has turned it's back in the working class man some time ago?

Surely football as a whole did that years ago Dave?

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Ruudboy   

He is right but that doesn't mean he should say it publicly, it just gives the away fans another stick with which to beat us. If the team performs, or even puts in 100% effort, the support is there. It's very hard to get excited over corned beef when you've been served fillet steak on a regular basis.

Personally, I'm looking forward to burned Scouse pudding tonight. Nothing wrong with a little comfort food when life gets tough

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He is right but that doesn't mean he should say it publicly, it just gives the away fans another stick with which to beat us. If the team performs, or even puts in 100% effort, the support is there. It's very hard to get excited over corned beef when you've been served fillet steak on a regular basis.

Saturday was the perfect example of that.

Probably a large part of why our home support isn't very good.

Nothing wrong with trying to motivate the corned beef into a better state. Some clubs fans would've given it their all on Saturday and then gone crazy on the players for their performance.

But that's Chelsea and it has both good and bad effects: On the one hand, it keeps the crazy in check, and for football fans we're quite sensible. On the other, you get situations like Rafa Benitez becoming manager of our club (can anyone honestly see something like that happening at Liverpool?) or players that manage to never perform, but still get some form of support.

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Surely football as a whole did that years ago Dave?

Surely they did - no disputing that.

If they want working class support for most games they should target working class support. Not tourists with selfie-sticks.

That he's out supporting the Liverpool support is laughable. I've been to Anfield plenty of times and their suppose ain't nothing special. Yes - for their cup finals it is. It just happens their game of the season is a League Cup semi. I'm sure the Bridge is rocking for a CL semi (been the times I've seen one at least) or other big games.

To cry about lack of support at home to QPR is to not understand the problem and why it is that way.

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Khobar   

Although I agree with what you've said here I don't see the relevance of it to this particular discussion.

I'm not sure what evidence you want. Do you disagree the club has turned it's back in the working class man some time ago?

Do you disagree that Jose is our manager?

I thought everybody was middle class these days.

It's a paradox really - we all demand cheap tickets and and young local heroes at the same time as wanting suuccess and top class performances.

How do you think these forums would look if we sold tickets for £20 and stuck 4-6 youth team players in, had a raucous atmosphere, but of crowd trouble and ambitions to finish above the relegation zone?

Of course, we've done that before. I quite enjoyed it but I'm generally enjoying this more.

It's a balancing act and I'm afraid there's no easy answers. Who would our blueprint be in the Premier league?

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Khobar   

IMO the reality of the situation is

4) not finished.

The aim this year was to get our first 11 up to the level where it could challenge for trophies; specifically, one that can (should?) win the league. Weaknesses were identified, and remedies were sought. IMO we have that team and come May I think we will be champions (although it won't be easy, and it was never going to be).

The aim long term will be to build a squad that can challenge on every front, and be among the very best in the world. That can't be done overnight given the current reality of football, with squad limits and FFP.

I don't know what the precise schedule is (although I do know that this year the aim is the league title; Jose told us that often enough last season), but IMO we are on track. There was never going to be a grand overhaul, just piecemeal improvements, and (while recognising that perfection is some way off) I (personally) am happy with the progress we have made. Next year, expectations will be higher again (possibly more in line with the expectations of some here, although the reality is that we may not truly see that come fruition for another 2 or 3 seasons), and hopefully we can meet them; chip away more dead wood and add more quality to the squad (something that looks to be under way).

Very well put.

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paulw66   

Surely they did - no disputing that.

If they want working class support for most games they should target working class support. Not tourists with selfie-sticks.

I don't understand how you would even begin to implement such a thing. You can only but a ticket if you bring your high vis jacket and a shovel........

When we started doing well in the mid 90s the demand for STs went through the roof, and there are now close to 30k ST holders. These aren't tourists, they are people who go week in week out. The problem is that people now aren't relinquishing their tickets as we are doing well and hence we have an aging support.......what is the answer? Anyone over 50 gets their ST rescinded? Madness.

The main issue is complacency. I go to SB and expect us to win 90% of our matches. I can't help it, that is the way it is and I have been a ST holder since 1991. I find it difficult to get "up" for a home game with Bradford, or just about any of the bottom half of the Premier League. The atmosphere would be much better if we were sh*t.

Tickets for the Bradford game were £15 for concessions. How much lower do you want it to get? This is 2015......a price of beer in London is over £4, a decent steak will cost £25. Going to the cinema on Saturday evening in Fulham Broadway cost me almost as much as my ticket for Chelsea.........My season ticket cost me £940, approx £50 a game, which I think is pretty decent.

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Ruudboy   

Be clear, it's not young the young bloods who do the singing - the old guys can get pretty vociferous too (although I confess there are some who might as well indent for bath chair now). No, it's more about attitude than age - the old guy in the dapper suit next to me at a CL match was jumping on his chair with the lads when we scored, and when I expressed surprise, he said he was chair of a large company and this was all that kept him from strangling his Board members.

Perhaps try going to a lower league club occasionally? Those of us who rough it find it's a different experience to the big clubs, and maybe it's time we learned from them. Any fool can win, but support ain't about wininng all the time - where's the excitement in that? It's the pleasure of the chase. And watching a certain lower league club clamber out of the Conference and hold Man U to a draw gave me almost as much pleasure as watching Munich 2012 (not quite, but close ...). And no, I didn't go to the Man U match, but I did go to see Cambridge v Luton in the previous round, and the atmosphere was something to behold. Not bad for a crowd of 7-8k total, on traditional terraces in the freezing rain and no beer on sale except in the "posh" stand ...

No, it's a culture thing, not age or expectation. We have to change the culture so that there's less of the "I can't sing, I feel a fool" ethos. More "it's a football match; that's what you do". And to be honest, if you guys in the East Upper (presumably) contributed to the noise other than applauding when you hear "East Stand give us a song", then us in the Shed etc. would be most obliged. Nothing personal, honest, but sometimes we wonder if there's anyone up there!

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